Vitamin C Forum

jimmylesante wrote:My understanding of the diets going round is HF(saturated fats) and LC(simple carbs-particularly trans fats fulled carbs...biscuits etc) Always a big helping of veggies which make up most of the meal.
I've seen people eat 90% fat and protein and 10% veggies---this to me is not correct nor sustainable.
The concepts of high fat and high protein i've always believed was to stop the hunger pangs whilst the body switched from a glucose burning machine to a fat burning machine. The foundation of the diets being a 90% bed of vegetables that does the good stuff.

I don't normally now join threads started by the OP of this one, but I feel I cannot let the above mixture of mis-understandings pass without comment:

The concept of the low-carb diet, popularised by Robert Atkins goes back way before Atkins, at least to William Banting in the 1860s. He didn't invent it either, merely popularised it for his generation. But anyway, Atkins-style diets were never meant to be high-protein, even if some people interpreted them that way. They were high-fat, medium protein, and low-carb.

Some people refer to this as LCHF. The goal with Atkins and similar diets was always to lower insulin levels and permit mobilisation of stored body fat. Sometimes this resulted in ketosis and sometimes not.

In more recent times, the concept of explicit ketogenic diets has come to the fore, which are similar to LCHF, but usually with lower carbs, and also more control of protein (since protein also elicits an insulin response, and can potentially lead to gluconeogenesis). Some people refer to this as LCHF/Keto.

More on "Keto" here:

http://2ketodudes.com
https://www.ketogenicforums.com

For a history of LCHF, "Good Calories, Bad Calories" ("The Diet Delusion" in the UK), by Gary Taubes, is a good start.

That's an excellent video pamojja. I've been 'discussing' this issue with my doctor, who continues to claim that CAC scores are useless (in assessing disease progression and risk) and that I should be taking statins to lower my LDL and hence my risk of heart attack / stroke after having a TIA last October. I've dramatically lowered by Lp(a) from 60mg/dL to 30mg/dL (V-C 5g plus Niacin 1.5g) which he also states is meaningless. It's all about statins and LDL according to him. The drug companies are certainly successful with their propaganda machine...

Hmmm - Ornish / vegetarian vs LCHF? Both can be excellent depending on the individual. The key thing is - get rid of processed rubbish, trans fats and added sugar, especially HFCS from your diet.

I agree pamojja fat is not the bad guy..

yet, with a simple caloric deficit, you can lose fat, as this prof did eating mostly junk food
http://www.cnn.com/2010/HEALTH/11/08/tw ... professor/

so good calories bad calories? nah, just make a caloric deficit

I agree with you here ZARFAS (although you are similar to another poster with similar....views.)
However let's make it healthy and not just "caloric deficit" that some idiot professor did to prove.....what exactly? If he really wanted to make a splash maybe he should have eaten his own pooop and still lost weight.

calories in/out to get caloric deficit and get lean IS the way to good health

Really where do you get this shite from? Go eat sugar for the next 30days caloric deficit and let's see how much GOOD HEALTH you are in at the end of that.
If you gonna be a moron, be a moron on someone elses time.

Zarfas, I'm careful not to get carried away on blood test results. These are good feedback that changes in diet, lifestyle and supplementation are having desired effect, however a much more reliable indicator will be my calcium score this November. Normally CAD progresses at 30% to 35% annually so I'm hoping for my CAC score to show a lesser rate of increase...
The big bonus to me is my fitness and energy levels which are sky high, compared to the sedentary and overweight individual person I was just a short time ago. The body we have is an amazing and resilient machine, even after years of abuse and neglect...

Zarfas, I'm careful not to get carried away on blood test results. These are good feedback that changes in diet, lifestyle and supplementation are having desired effect, however a much more reliable indicator will be my calcium score this November. Normally CAD progresses at 30% to 35% annually so I'm hoping for my CAC score to show a lesser rate of increase...
The big bonus to me is my fitness and energy levels which are sky high, compared to the sedentary and overweight individual person I was just a short time ago. The body we have is an amazing and resilient machine, even after years of abuse and neglect...

It's leptin

Yes, to lose weight our calorific expenditure must exceed intake. The point of leptin is about hunger. If hunger controls us, then we will lose the battle. I keep my hunger at bay by high consumption of olive oil, coconut oil, coconut cream, walnuts and macadamia nuts. Even though these are very high in calories they satisfy and I have mastery over appetite. I also keep away from all grains & junk

Zarfas,
I'm 6' and weigh 172.2lbs. Is that a fat ass? I ran 10 marathons years ago and I was 10 lbs HEAVIER! I lost weight recently by walking every day for a minimum of 1 hr. I did that intentionally to see if high fat low carb and without counting calories if I would lose the weight? You know what the answer is? Yes and I'm lean!

http://www.grindtv.com/paddle-sports/hu ... -fat-diet/

Zarfas,
Did you read this?????
http://www.grindtv.com/paddle-sports/hu ... -fat-diet/

You are ideas are all WRONG. I can educate YOU on nutrition and health. I have over 20 years experience on the subject and I have gone through every type of diet and I do know something about nutrition and health.

You refer me to an article from CNN about a professor who ate twinkies and that supposed to make me think that sugar is healthy, ????????? He did for 10 wks? ??? What happens for the rest of his life? You think he's going to eat twinkies for the rest of his life?,,??
From your article :
"His success is probably a result of caloric reduction, said Dawn Jackson Blatner, a dietitian in Chicago, Illinois.
"It's a great reminder for weight loss that calories count," she said. "Is that the bottom line to being healthy? That's another story."

He says "Probably a result of caloric reduction "? ???? CICO is a total MYTH!!!!! Professor or not he has it WRONG. It's not CICO but the hormones that regulate the fat in the body. The CICO is a physics law not a human biology one. It just doesn't WORK.

We're on 2 different paths.
Let's call it a truce and go on to something else ?

Zarfas,
I respect you but not your ideas about health and nutrition.
I wrote down things in a passionate manner but not in haste or anger.
As I said we're on 2 different paths and I'm ok with that.
Good luck and all the best