Tocotrienols

The discussion of the Linus Pauling vitamin C/lysine invention for chronic scurvy

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confused1
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Tocotrienols

Post Number:#1  Post by confused1 » Fri Sep 15, 2017 8:07 am

This study from 2011 says point blank that tocotrienols suppress, regress, and slow the progression of arteriosclerosis, and lower serum lipids while raising HDL-C.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21774782

In studying I have found that alpha tocopherol actually inhibits the uptake and utilization of tocotrienols. They should be taken separately and perhaps alpha tocopherol should be de-emphasized in favor of tocotrienols.

This could be a valuable addition to the Pauling therapy.
Tocotrienols were relatively unstudied in Pauling's lifetime but are coming to the fore today. They may account for some of the disparity between positive outcomes in studies of dietary intake of Vitamin E versus negative outcomes in studies involving primarily alpha tocopherol supplementation.

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Re: Tocotrienols

Post Number:#2  Post by tangy » Fri Sep 15, 2017 4:34 pm

I am taking Unique E tocopherols should I stop that and start taking Tocotrienols instead?

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Re: Tocotrienols

Post Number:#3  Post by confused1 » Fri Sep 15, 2017 4:54 pm

I'm just going to add them. But if you do take both, take them separately, like breakfast and dinner so they don't compete for absorption. But check out the research, it looks really promising.

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Re: Tocotrienols

Post Number:#4  Post by tangy » Fri Sep 15, 2017 5:16 pm

Ok, will do. Thanks.

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Re: Tocotrienols

Post Number:#5  Post by francisunderwood » Fri Sep 15, 2017 8:30 pm

For what tocotrienols cost you want to make sure you get maximum absorption!

I have been taking 1 of the delta fraction 125mg and 2 of the doctors best 50mg per day. That mixture cuts costs a bit plus gets a nice balance with all 4 tocotrienols.

I still take a vitamin e tocopherol mix but its mostly d alpha. I take it in the morning and the tocotrienols in the evening.

The studies that I have seen that say vitamin e is bad or dangerous have used the synthetic version which is dl alpha.

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Re: Tocotrienols

Post Number:#6  Post by confused1 » Fri Sep 15, 2017 10:02 pm

francisunderwood wrote:For what tocotrienols cost you want to make sure you get maximum absorption!

I have been taking 1 of the delta fraction 125mg and 2 of the doctors best 50mg per day. That mixture cuts costs a bit plus gets a nice balance with all 4 tocotrienols.

I still take a vitamin e tocopherol mix but its mostly d alpha. I take it in the morning and the tocotrienols in the evening.

The studies that I have seen that say vitamin e is bad or dangerous have used the synthetic version which is dl alpha.
Do you feel it's helping you? I realize that study is a few years old so I was hoping someone with experience would chime in. I definitely didn't mean to imply that tocopherols were dangerous, just that tocotrienols seemed to be more effective for certain things. Dr Passwater has an excellent discussion of them with a leading expert at drpasswater.com. Go to the articles section and you'll find them.

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Re: Tocotrienols

Post Number:#7  Post by francisunderwood » Fri Sep 15, 2017 10:27 pm

Something has helped but I went crazy adding supplements. I can say for sure that the C, Lysine and proline combo lowered my cholesterol and triglycerides as well as my blood pressure.

Since that test I have added 400 iu of solgar vitamin e tocopherols which is mainly d alpha. I also added the tocotrienols around that same time.

My blood pressure has dropped a little more to where it is at the high end of normal now but not sure if that was from more time on the C, lysine and proline or just a collective benefit.

As of now I take 6 grams of C, 4 grams lysine, 1 gram proline, 6000 iu vitamin d(5000 didn't get me up to where I need to be but close), 1 B50, 1000mcg b12, vitamin e 400 iu, 125 mg delta fraction tocotrienol. 100 mg doctors best tocotrienols, 200 coq10, 500 mg quercetin(for prostate health), 300 mg magnesium and 30 mg zinc.

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Re: Tocotrienols

Post Number:#8  Post by confused1 » Fri Sep 15, 2017 10:55 pm

Lol doesn't sound crazy to me. I take all that and a few more. I'm taking dmso, taurine, extra b5, b3, b6, and folic acid on top of my b complex, saw palmetto, selenium, iodine (lugol's), fish oil, vitamin a, k1 and k2, hawthorne berry, black seed oil, garlic oil, NAC, alpha lipoic acid, acetyl carnitine, lutein, lycopene, (stinging nettle, tribulus, dhea, and avena sativa for libido so not everyday), Olive leaf and celery seed extract, milk thistle (grow my own), L-citrulline (homemade), potassium, and resveratrol. Occasionally I take melatonin and valerian for sleep. I'm going to start taking DMG, which was once thought to be a b vitamin. And now tocotrienols. I'm bound to get healthy if the price tag doesn't kill me!

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Re: Tocotrienols

Post Number:#9  Post by Lunes Payling » Mon Sep 18, 2017 6:09 am

Working off that abstract and assuming the integrity of the author, it does seem likely there are possible benefit from adding tocotrienols for patients with heart disease. What do we know?

First, the problem with vitamin E, unlike most of the other vitamins, is that there is no single identified vitamin E deficiency disease (i.e., scurvy for vitamin C, or pellagra for vitamin B3, etc.) so how do we know what vitamin E even is? It is possible that heart attack is the vitamin E deficiency disease, by the way.

We know that vitamin E is the fat-soluble antioxidant that works in the lipid areas of the cell. Vitamin C is the primary water-soluble antioxidant and alpha lipoic acid is both fat and water soluble. I assume the tocotrienol form of vitamin E is fat soluble?

We also know from the work of the Shute brothers, and reported by Linus Pauling, that alpha tocopherol has a primary effect on heart disease, perhaps the main effect is by helping to recycle vitamin C in tissues. I would not stop taking Unique-E if I had heart disease. We know it works, and while the tocotrienols form may (or may not) be a break through, it is more speculative than the tocopherols - especially the mixed tocopherols in the Uniqu-E.

My first exposure to any writing about tocotrienols was in the Hickey/Roberts: CANCER: Nutrition and Survival book. There is a section on studies showing that tocotrienols can have a primary effect slowing cancers.

A. C. Grace started as a Vitamin E company. They added tocotrienols - because of pressure/demand, and I would expect their web site to have a balanced look at any science.


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