Here's the result of my VAP test

The discussion of the Linus Pauling vitamin C/lysine invention for chronic scurvy

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Re: Here's the result of my VAP test

Post Number:#16  Post by ofonorow » Thu Mar 18, 2010 10:49 am


Did you ever get the email w/ my Vap results?



Ah no - but maybe I didn't recognize the email - or maybe it is in my spam folder.. I'll check
Owen R. Fonorow, Orthomolecular Naturopath
My statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. Any product mentioned is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease.”

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Re: Here's the result of my VAP test

Post Number:#17  Post by scottbushey » Thu Mar 18, 2010 10:52 am

I believe I sent it from busheys@ccf.org

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Re: Here's the result of my VAP test

Post Number:#18  Post by scottbushey » Mon May 02, 2011 2:27 pm

Owen et. al.,
I am at a loss and quite depressed. Even after drinking the Home brew Lypo C and dropping just under 20 lbs., my cholesterol levels are still bad. In fact, my LPa has gotten larger! I must tell you honestly, I do not know what to do. Please compare my earlier labs taken in Dec 2010 (at the beginning of this thread) to the present results.

Here's a link to my photobucket:
http://s940.photobucket.com/albums/ad241/scottbushey/?action=view&current=labs_2011.jpg

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Re: Here's the result of my VAP test

Post Number:#19  Post by Cobraman » Mon May 02, 2011 7:47 pm

This is the first time that I have read this thread and I believe that it is possible that I can help. If you are still taking inositol hexaniacinate you should stop and then start taking regular niacin. Although there are contrary reports, inositol hexaniacinate does nothing for cholesterol and the lipid profile. I tried this myself to get through the conflicting reports and found it did absolutely nothing. If you want your ldl lowered, hdl raised, lp(a) lowered use 1000mg of plain niacin three times a day. This dose is cut in half for time release niacin. Time release is somewhat better at lowering ldl, but doesn't raise hdl as much. Also is more likely to cause liver damage(hence half the dosage). Although plain niacin causes a flush, this can be controlled w/ taking a daily low dose aspirin. After 2 weeks your body becomes accustomed to the niacin and the aspirin is unnecessary. W/ what I have read prob. the best otc brand is Schiff niacin. I would suggest reading "Cholesterol Control Without Diet, the Niacin Solution" by William Parsons, MD who learned of niacin from Abram Hoffer. Plain niacin did all of the things that I had mentioned for me. My cholesterol afterwards went up after starting Pauling therapy which Owen said could happen in the short term. I will be having labs done in June or July to see how PT with niacin does. I will be posting results.

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Re: Here's the result of my VAP test

Post Number:#20  Post by scottbushey » Mon May 09, 2011 2:25 pm

so now I'm on ignore status............

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Re: Here's the result of my VAP test

Post Number:#21  Post by ofonorow » Tue May 10, 2011 7:56 am

Both of you, keep us posted. Thank you johnwen for reminding me about B3 (niacin).

Also, please consider having your retinal images photographed, and post them for later analysis/comparison. (I believe doctor Bush's instructions are "45% fundus" camera. I am currently searching for a chain of optometrists who will routinely provide these images.)
Owen R. Fonorow, Orthomolecular Naturopath
My statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. Any product mentioned is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease.”

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Re: Here's the result of my VAP test

Post Number:#22  Post by jknosplr » Fri May 13, 2011 5:11 am

Bush I was on 2 gr SloNiacin for over 12months, lowering the Tot C and LDL was negligible but the HDL I got as high as 50. I also had a LDL pattern change from B (small) to A (large). I never did get acclimated to the flush just dealt with it. As for Protonix I had been on that also on and off, I currently have been diagnose with lesions in the stomach and Protonix is what was prescribed for the second time. Maybe there is a connection with the Protonix as the C protocol is not working very well for me either?? I have been taking Inositol for several months now due to "high Iron" haven't had a Iron panel done as of late. It does not appear that Iron is questioned in your thread, perhaps you Iron panel was low and discounted?

On Jan 1st added following after second MI
20mg Simvastatin /Metoprol/Lisinopril/ Plavix

Lipid panel 4/25/2001
Total 145 mg/dl
HDL 44 mg/dl
Tri 98 mg/dl Tri never seem to move much no matter what I take??
LDL 81 mg/dl

LP(a) 18 nmol/L

I know that satins are looked down upon here but one needs a back up plan to continue your endeavors if the first is not producing results. I been just as disgusted as you here lately, angry, disheartened also. Do not give it up, keep after it you may lose but you can't win if you don't fight.

jk
Last edited by jknosplr on Sun May 15, 2011 4:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Here's the result of my VAP test

Post Number:#23  Post by ofonorow » Sat May 14, 2011 7:06 am

I think the clear explanation contained in article by Pharmacist Mike Ciell is worth revisiting:
http://www.ourhealthcoop.com/pdf/MikeCiell_unified_theory.pdf

Although the above cholesterol numbers are "low," Mike explains how and why taking drugs that artificially lower your numbers render them meaningless for diagnostic purposes.

And yes, research and logic both support the notion that low stomach acid interferes with the absorption of ascorbic acid (vitamin C).
Owen R. Fonorow, Orthomolecular Naturopath
My statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. Any product mentioned is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease.”

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Re: Here's the result of my VAP test

Post Number:#24  Post by jknosplr » Sat May 14, 2011 11:15 am

Mike explains how and why taking drugs that artificially lower your numbers render them meaningless for diagnostic purposes.


If numbers are lower whether artificially or other wise to me that means less plaque build up. Hence longer time on this earth to explore why I have this condition CVD to start with. Since the C protocol is not giving the results that its advertised, then one must experiment with parallel protocols. I could take red yeast rice which has a "natural satin" would that be artificially lowering the numbers?? I don't care which protocol works as long as it works. Perhaps my genetics impede the VC protocol, I did not read any thing about that. In fact I did not read any thing that addressed the VC protocol not working in your link. This leads one to believe that all you have to do is follow the instructions and presto I'm good to go. Now it may have worked on many people and as far as I see I have gotten benefits from the protocol, it just did not do in three years what I had anticipated.
Enter the stains, to me just another avenue that should be open for those of us that are genetically deficient and cannot be cured by natural means (VC). I believe that even "Big Pharmacy" as you call them has done some good for the Homo-sapiens even if they do turn a profit. Modern medicine even diagnose a problem for you here some time back if memory serves me. Tower labs must turn a profit or out of business they go, and you with them and Doc Levy as a kicker.... correct? So why the hate for cholesterol lowering drugs? Each to his own and what ever helps one fight a disease should not be frowned upon by an entity that maintains a different school of thought. Unless that entity feels threatened!

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Re: Here's the result of my VAP test

Post Number:#25  Post by scottbushey » Mon May 16, 2011 5:13 am

JK,
I have been off of Proton Pump Inhibitors for almost a year now. I'm beginning to think the culprit rests in my liver-I'm gonna try a two fold attack here: 1) Paleo diet-no carbs; no refined sugars. 2) Liver detox.

Owen,
I have to agree w/ JK here to a degree. You guys have left us snap in the wind. I agree that the statins are not the route to go; however, you'd think that since we are such odd cases, you and Livon Labs would take us on as challenging cases and use our situations as study cases-fund us with supplementation-write it off as donations. As JK mentions, you don't ever mention that the protocol doesn't work in some cases.....if it doesn't, help us!

You never even responded to my messages about my recent tests vs my previous one's. Thats disheartening to say the least-it comes across as *you're interested as long as we are successful, otherwise, you're not!

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Re: Here's the result of my VAP test

Post Number:#26  Post by ofonorow » Mon May 16, 2011 2:59 pm

Well, I have been behind, and if you didn't receive my responses to your PMs then something is wrong. From memory the GIST of my response was that I strongly dislike the company you got those cholesterol numbers from !?! (I once tried to verify their numbers with my own blood, but they refused to do it.)

I suggested several others that draw and test blood, including Life Extension Foundation, that I would trust before getting bent out of shape.

We spend a great deal of time at this forum on trying to figure out why the Pauling protocol may not work well in individual cases. As far as we can determine from reports, compliance is the big issue. Time after time, people admit they stopped or slowed the protocol, and as with Carol Smith, it becomes fairly easy to predict that some six months later the inevitable MI happens.

In your case, I don't know of any evidence that it isn't working "as advertised" except for your elevated cholesterol readings. I think that is why I suggested getting a 45%, color (1 MEG fudus photo) - and lets see what is really going on.

But for the sake of argument, lets assume your elevated cholesterol does indicate that your CVD is progressing (has not been halted or reversed in your case). The question is why? Why are you (and perhaps JK) different from the many other cases we have reported and observed? But before we can really attack that question more than we already have, we need to verify that this is true. That you are not becoming more, rather than less diseased. Other than the cholesterol numbers, do you have any other evidence things are getting worse? Higher blood pressures, chest pains, fatigue, etc??

p.s. love your paleo-diet, no sugar idea!
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My statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. Any product mentioned is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease.”

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Re: Here's the result of my VAP test

Post Number:#27  Post by ofonorow » Mon May 16, 2011 3:23 pm

scottbushey wrote:JK,
however, you'd think that since we are such odd cases, you and Livon Labs would take us on as challenging cases and use our situations as study cases-fund us with supplementation-write it off as donations. As JK mentions, you don't ever mention that the protocol doesn't work in some cases.....if it doesn't, help us!


You know there is a very long case in the case study chapter of my book - the Carol Smith case - that is a convincing report that the protocol doesn't work - if people feel cured and don't continue the vitamin C/lysine. She relapsed (seemed to fail over and over and over.) (She was honest enough to let us know that each time she was convinced for various reasons to stop.) So I don't understand that I don't mention it doesn't work in some cases.

And to my knowledge, the only case where there is strong evidence the protocol isn't working is JK (maybe you, but I don't see the strong evidence - yet) and JK is well enough to continue posting.

After reading Levy's STOP AMERICA'S #1 KILLER, I admit to less understanding of why Pauling's vitamin C/lysine seems to work so fast in those severely ill with CVD. The reasons that old, involved plaques are not easily resolved becomes obvious. And, in fact, the ability of vitamin C and lysine to remove pain such that heart patients who could not walk across the room are able to paint their homes in 30 days, seems impossible. So there is something that Pauling clearly understood that I do not understand.
Owen R. Fonorow, Orthomolecular Naturopath
My statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. Any product mentioned is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease.”

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Re: Here's the result of my VAP test

Post Number:#28  Post by jknosplr » Mon May 16, 2011 4:42 pm

and JK is well enough to continue posting.


And I intend to keep posting as long as there is life in me or you cancel my subscription for being out spoken. I'm 58 had 2 Mi's I have better things to do than sit here and not be honest with you. If I was not honest I would just stop posting and go way, by building a facade I fool no one but my self. The board will not know what happen should I expire, for communications will cease you'll continue with the apparatus.
I sent you over a year ago an Excel spread sheet of my cholesterol readings an dosages of vitamin C. I have not stopped the protocol even after the second MI, but I felt like it.
You don't understand that when you are sick not just just CVD that you will try any thing and every thing to beat it. Its a natural instinct to survive, if there is the smallest chance one will stay with a program. There is no proof any where that it hasn't had some benefit, I'll be the first to admit it, and that's the only reason I'm still here.
Why Bush and I are the exception to the rule is beyond me, there has to be more people that either gave up, decided to no longer post or expired,or has not followed up as intensely as Bush and myself. There has to be more or the board would be full of success stories and the Gov would be trying to control the VC protocol and license it!
Nothing for nothing I posted Retinal photos and got back a opinion, well all one has to do is read my posts to know that I suffer from CVD and an opinion can be written to order. Tell me something I don't know!! When queried further I got stone walled.
I posted 4 snap shots of a RCA and heard nothing absolutely nothing! There are reported to be several heart doctors on this board, not one opinion. No other catherization photos were ever posted by a poster on this board to my knowledge??
I post data on the board for feedback if you would you like me to sign a release from liability... write it up. I can't speak for Bushy , but I'll entertain any study or program you would like to recommend.
I retired due to CVD so I have plenty of time to maintain the dosages I say I'm taking....
jk

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Re: Here's the result of my VAP test

Post Number:#29  Post by Johnwen » Sun May 22, 2011 8:24 pm

Scott & JK
Have you had a insulin,C-peptide and GTT test??
If yes can you post results.
To steal ideas from one person is plagiarism. To steal from many is
research!

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Re: Here's the result of my VAP test

Post Number:#30  Post by jknosplr » Mon May 23, 2011 4:30 am

On 6/20/2009 Serum Glucose done while in the hospital for stenting. number was 82. any thing <140 mg/dl was in range. Only one I am aware of.
I could make a trip to the records dept and request the last set of blood work from 02/01/2011 If the test is run as a standard when admitted or after admission it may be there, if the doc requested it.


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