How to Lower Moderately Elevated Lp(a)

The discussion of the Linus Pauling vitamin C/lysine invention for chronic scurvy

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How to Lower Moderately Elevated Lp(a)

Post Number:#1  Post by ofonorow » Wed Jun 06, 2018 8:36 am

I was wondering if you have any research, published or otherwise, to share regarding its effectiveness in lowering Lp(a).

I was reading the Vitamin C Foundation forum on the subject and it was really interesting to hear your story of the New York medical school professor who had lowered his Lp(a) to zero after a year of vitamin C, lysine and proline supplementation. Do you know whether he was taking the equivalent of two packs of Cardio-C per day? Was he also taking niacin?

Lp(a) is a concern of mine due to a strong family history of cardiovascular disease and my recently measured Lp(a) of 101 nmol/L (Risk: Optimal < 75 nmol/L; Moderate 75-125 nmol/L; High > 125 nmol/L Cardiovascular event risk category cut points (optimal, moderate, high) are based on Marcovina et al. Clin Chem. 2003;49:1785 and Nordestgaard et al. European Heart J. 2010;31:2844 (results of meta-analysis and expert panel recommendations).


This "moderately high” Lp(a) level is quite unexpected given my overall excellent health and otherwise minuscule cardiovascular disease risk. However, I do have some longstanding damage to my stomach lining that I’m trying to heal, which prevents me from digesting protein adequately. Thus, despite aggressive vitamin C supplementation, it appears that I need a boost in amino acids to finish the job. I started on 250 mg niacin supplementation a couple of weeks prior to my recent lab test, so I suppose that will have its own effect on Lp(a) down the road.


It sounds like you are keeping up with the forum, and thus you know that there really is no scientific evidence that elevated Lp(a) can be lowered. (In the Pauling/Rath experiments, Vitamin C in guinea pigs prevented apo(a) from rising).

If your Lp(a) is really elevated, the very best thing you can do is take Lp(a) binding inhibitors (e.g. vitamin C, lysine and proline) into the blood which at a high concentration seems to keep Lp(a) from attaching to strands of lysine that may appear after an arterial lesion.

And as you say, the NY Medical School professor noticed that it was the addition of proline that apparently lowered his Lp(a) (Thus his excited call...)

Anecdotally, forum members taking Pauling's high-vitamin C/lysine therapy for years, who have had their Lp(a) measured, have discovered that their Lp(a) is low.. Usually less than 2 mg/dl. Most are also supplementing proline.

If your "moderately high" Lp(a) is measured (not calculated) that is an indication that you "aggressive vitamin C supplementation" may not be enough. How much vitamin C are you now taking daily? What is your total cholesterol in mg/dl?

Forum members have reported that Life Extension counselors/experts have found studies showing that carnitine lowers Lp(a).
Owen R. Fonorow, Follow #OWENRFONOROW at twitter

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Re: How to Lower Moderately Elevated Lp(a)

Post Number:#2  Post by zarfas » Wed Jun 06, 2018 8:53 am

good info here
thanks

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Re: How to Lower Moderately Elevated Lp(a)

Post Number:#3  Post by Johnwen » Wed Jun 06, 2018 10:53 am

First let’s do a little math!
To convert nmol/L to mg/dl for LP(a) you simply divide by 2.5!
So this person reports a 110 nmol/L level.
So 110 / 2.5 = 44 mg/dl

Which isn’t all that bad!

Now let’s look at some of things in the body that can add to the production of LP(a).
Uncontrolled Diabetes
Low thyroid output
Kidney problems
Medicines that cause problems, Diuretics, Beta Blockers, Birth control pills
Liver problems

Looking at what chemicals can stop the production of LP(a) in a priority order.
1. Proline
2. Tranexamate (used as a fragrance enhancer in skin creams)
3. e-aminocaproate (Clotting promoter) UGH!
4. Arginine
5. Lysine

I think one can see 2 and 3 probably aren’t very good to take for this!

So another point is how LP(a) is formed well triglycerides levels play a very big role in this process. For those who want to get techy! Their formed from with the APOB-48 and APOB-100 forms!
So a look at their last blood work for cholesterol and see what their Triglycerides levels were. My guess is they were recorded as high!
So other then taking their V-C+ Drink, lowering these levels would be the next step! Let’s look at some ideas on doing this.
Loosing weight
Diet (cut down on fats and sugars)
Exercise
Very modest Alcohol consumption! 1 or 2 NO MORE!
Niacin
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research!

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Re: How to Lower Moderately Elevated Lp(a)

Post Number:#4  Post by ofonorow » Thu Jun 07, 2018 8:16 am

More data.. numbers look very good to me...

To answer your questions:


Recent results from a Cardio IQ Advanced Lipid Panel:

Total cholesterol 152 mg/dL (RR <200 mg/dL)
HDL 82 mg/dL (RR >50 mg/dL)
LDL 61 mg/dL (RR <100 mg/dL) (LDL-C is now calculated using the Martin-Hopkins calculation, which is a validated novel method providing better accuracy than the Friedewald equation in the estimation of LDL-C. Martin SS et al. JAMA. 2013;310(19): 2061-2068)
Triglycerides 33 mg/dL (RR <150 mg/dL)

hsCRP 0.3 (lower cardiovascular risk <1)

LDL particle size data from this testing service are confusing, but insurance covered it so that’s why my doctor ordered it. I prefer the NMR Lipid Profile and will have that done sometime before the end of this year.


Recent results from a Genova Diagnostics ION Profile:

Proline 114 µmol/L (95% RR 99-363)
Hydroxyproline 15 µmol/L (95% RR ≤ 26)
Lysine 157 µmol/L (95% RR 120-318)
Hydroxylysine <0.6 µmol/L (95% RR <0.6)

Methionine 21 µmol/L (95% RR 14-48)
Cystathionine <0.3 µmol/L (95% RR ≤ 0.3)
Homocystine <0.6 µmol/L (95% RR ≤ 0.6)
Cystine 5.1 µmol/L (95% RR 0.8-27.5)
Taurine 53 µmol/L (95% RR 29-136)

Homocysteine 7.3 nmol/mL (95% RR 3.0-14.0)

Lipid Peroxides 1.00 (95% RR ≤ 2.60)


Current relevant daily dietary supplementation (spread throughout the day):

1,000 to 2,000 mg liposomal vitamin C (LivOn Labs)
2,000 to 4,000 mg mixed ascorbates (Perque Potent C Guard)
1,000 mg China-free Ultrafine L-ascorbic acid
250 mg niacin
500 mg acetyl-L-carnitine (as acetyl-L-carnitine chloride)
No amino acid supplements


I am NOT on the "metabolic syndrome" spectrum at all— nowhere near it— so what to make of high Lp(a) in isolation? I’ll be looking into this.

At any rate, in addition to the above, I will start taking Cardio-C (2 packs per day). Should be interesting. I’ll keep you posted.

Thanks again,
Owen R. Fonorow, Follow #OWENRFONOROW at twitter

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Re: How to Lower Moderately Elevated Lp(a)

Post Number:#5  Post by ofonorow » Thu Jun 07, 2018 3:28 pm

johnwen wrote:Now let’s look at some of things in the body that can add to the production of LP(a).
Uncontrolled Diabetes
Low thyroid output
Kidney problems
Medicines that cause problems, Diuretics, Beta Blockers, Birth control pills
Liver problems



My reply:

I do not have diabetes or pre-diabetes.
My thyroid was damaged long ago by exposure to a nuclear accident so I am currently on natural thyroid replacement therapy; my TSH, T4, T3, and reverse T3 levels are all fine, with thyroid antibodies in the normal range.
My eGFR was 96 in a recent lab test (Reference Range: > OR = 60 (mL/min/1.73m2)), so I presume that my kidneys are healthy.
I take no pharmaceutical drugs.
I don’t have any liver problems that I’m aware of; my liver enzymes and other parameters are all normal.

In addition, I should mention that my arginine level as measured in a recent ION Profile was 77 (95% RR 29-137).

My weight is a bit below "normal" for my height. FYI I am female.

I do not expose myself to:

2. Tranexamate (used as a fragrance enhancer in skin creams)
3. e-aminocaproate (Clotting promoter) UGH!

The above two substances have the effect of blocking Lp(a) production? Would you mind passing on the literature references for this?— thanks!

Now that we’ve cleared up that I’m not falling apart….. stay tuned for what happens when I add Cardio-C to my regimen for a year. I’ll be back!
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Re: How to Lower Moderately Elevated Lp(a)

Post Number:#6  Post by Johnwen » Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:01 am

Here’s a article that will get you started on the subject of LP(a).
It gives the who, what and why!
Since I don’t know you level of knowledge on the subject I choose this one, to give you more of a basic knowledge of the workings!


http://www.drkaslow.com/html/lipoprotein_a.html
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research!

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Re: How to Lower Moderately Elevated Lp(a)

Post Number:#7  Post by maryclaire » Wed Jun 13, 2018 2:45 pm

I really enjoyed reading your link Johnwen! It really filled gaps for me and gave me information I wanted to know...thanks!


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